The Author: Sophie Madeline Dess
The Book: What You Make of Me (Penguin Press, 2025)
The Elevator Pitch: Two enigmatic and unforgettable siblings confront what—and who—they’re willing to sacrifice for their art.
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The Rumpus: Where did the idea of your book come from?
Sophie Madeline Dess: I have always been fascinated by artists, obsessive people, and the concept of rivalry. And while my novel does revolve around these elements, I wouldn’t be able to tell you where the real germ of the idea came from. I have also loved studying the dynamics between siblings, outside of my own family—the resentments that form, the co-dependencies, and the urges to separate. Add death, art, [and] obsession into the mix, and these dynamics are thrown into their highest relief, their fiercest intensity, their deepest reality. I was eager to get into all of this.
Rumpus: How long did it take to write the book?
Dess: From beginning to end, two years or so. But within that time, there were tons of fits and starts, lots of revelations that turned into very bad ideas, and very bad ideas that turned into revelations. . . . It was not a straight shot, but more like a crab walk. A crab crawl.
Rumpus: Is this the first book you’e written? If not, what made it the first to be published?
Dess: I’ve got some old manuscripts tucked away in a drawer somewhere. Most of those are terribly autobiographical. This was the first novel I wrote that felt far enough away from my life, maybe it was this that allowed me to imagine it out in the world.
Rumpus: In submitting the book, how many no’s did you get before your yes?
Dess: I never wanted to know!!!
Rumpus: Which authors/writers buoyed you along the way? How?
Dess: Oh boy. If this novel were to be opened and shaken, every book I’ve ever read and every work of art I’ve ever seen would fall out. Every novel—I must give a special shout out to Thomas Bernhard and James Baldwin here—every philosophical text, every biography and work of art history—and every painting, sculpture, studio I’ve visited—all of it would come out tumbling. I am sure this is true for every novel. I mention the authors Baldwin and Bernhard, in particular because they access sensuality and chaos and obsession and humor beautifully!
Rumpus: How did your book change over the course of working on it?
Dess: The book was initially conceived as a catalog of my narrator’s paintings, for her upcoming show. As I edited, I convinced myself it was okay to do away with that element, but then, at the last minute, I knew it was integral and added it back in, using footnotes. This was the largest change. There are too many micro-changes to name, including small adjustments to scenes, to chronology, and things like this. But at a certain point those changes begin to feel cosmetic. The trick is to know when the spirit and thrust of it is there.
Rumpus: Before your first book, where has your work been published?
Dess: The Paris Review, The Atlantic, Forever Magazine, The Washington Post, The New Republic, The Times Literary Supplement, and various other places.
Rumpus: What is the best advice someone gave you about publishing?
Dess: “Don’t do it.” It was a joke, of course, but the point was: You will never be satisfied. You will always worry that people will think your work fully represents you and all that you can do and all that you know. That it stands in for you. That it is you. When, the truth is, all you really want to do is escape it, move beyond it, write the new! That you are itching to be better, deeper, funnier, remade. The other advice was: “Authorize every word.” That was from Richard Ford. Authorize every word so that if you hate what you’ve done you have no one to blame but yourself!!! On a lighter note, another bit of advice was: “So what! Write another one!”
Rumpus: Who’s the reader you’re writing to—or tell us about your target audience and how you cultivated or found it?
Dess: My ideal audience is: Anyone, everyone. I think it is every writer’s dream that any person, from any walk of life and at any location in the world, picks up their book and feels all at once that they must and/or cannot stop reading it for their own specific reasons. I’m not a good cultivator of anything. I’ll take anyone.
Rumpus: What is one completely unexpected thing that surprised you about the process of getting your book published?
Dess: This might be cliche, but alas it is true, what always surprises and enlivens me is the seriousness and commitment with which people—throughout the publishing process—have read my novel. I am always and forever will be)amazed and beyond grateful when someone takes the time to read a word of what I’ve written. I do authorize each word I write, and I do mean what I say, and I am so happy when people find meaning within those words, in ways that surprise me and renew the text.
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Author photograph courtesy of Sophie Madeline Dess
